Spiky Bugger read my mind!! TMI POOP

[Barb1]

How about Jack Daniels shredded beef or Kirkland pulled pork? You can get them both at Costco or BJ's, and they are lovely tender. Kirkland's canned chicken with mayo and relish is another food option that's nice and soft.

I am going to have to get a membership at Costco. Thanks for the suggestion. Most of my meat goes into the food processor first and this helps but my tiny tummy doesn't hold much so I concentrate on getting just protein in first. I also have to make sure I get in all my vitamins so I put them in my yogurt so they start to desolve and then swallow them down. If I don't do that they make my tummy to full and uncomfortable for to long of a time.

 

[Elizabeth N.]

It's SUCH a bitch to be on the SS scale :-(. People who have not been there (or loved people who are there) have a tough time getting it. I'm very glad to be connected to the organization for which I'm doing development/fundraising precisely BECAUSE of this type of education I'm getting. It's fucking insane.

If you are able, a Costco membership could pay for itself quickly. Since you're out in "Middle America," I suspect that the grocery access alone would be a HUGE difference, plus the gas if you have a gas station there. You might check on the savings for pharmacy, as well.

 

[DianaCox]

Barb, I can imagine - even as relatively well off as we are, Charles had the lowers done in 2000 and wouldn't even spend the money for the uppers for 10 years. (And at full retail, in California, your prices look very low - his were something like $35K all told.) However, perhaps you can investigate whether you could get coverage - maybe with a dental school? - based on the fact that your bariatric surgery makes it important that you are able to eat a lot of high quality animal based protein? http://www.slu.edu/cade/patients/cost-of-care
"Cost Of Care
Fees collected at the time of service go toward the operation of the school's clinics and make it possible to offer dental services for Endodontics (root canals), Orthodontics (braces), and Periodontics (gum disease, implants) at a more reasonable price than in the private sector.

Fees for endodontic and periodontic services are generally 50-60% less than fees charged in private practices in the St. Louis area and payment is due at time of service.

We currently have an interest-free payment plan for orthodontic services that requires a down payment. We offer several different levels of treatment and we have discounts that include SLU employee, paid-in-full, and family discounts. Find out more about our payment options. "

Just a thought.

 

[Barb1]

Barb, I can imagine - even as relatively well off as we are, Charles had the lowers done in 2000 and wouldn't even spend the money for the uppers for 10 years. (And at full retail, in California, your prices look very low - his were something like $35K all told.) However, perhaps you can investigate whether you could get coverage - maybe with a dental school? - based on the fact that your bariatric surgery makes it important that you are able to eat a lot of high quality animal based protein? http://www.slu.edu/cade/patients/cost-of-care
"Cost Of Care
Fees collected at the time of service go toward the operation of the school's clinics and make it possible to offer dental services for Endodontics (root canals), Orthodontics (braces), and Periodontics (gum disease, implants) at a more reasonable price than in the private sector.

Fees for endodontic and periodontic services are generally 50-60% less than fees charged in private practices in the St. Louis area and payment is due at time of service.

We currently have an interest-free payment plan for orthodontic services that requires a down payment. We offer several different levels of treatment and we have discounts that include SLU employee, paid-in-full, and family discounts. Find out more about our payment options. "

Just a thought.

Thanks for checking this out Diana. I will check into it. I didn't realize we had a dental school anymore. Washington University used to have one long ago. When I checked out the cost it was for just 2 implants in the bottom to hold a bottom denture in place. You are right about the cost doing it the right way is about 30 grand here too. Like I said I'd have to win the lottery. I am constantly preaching to anyone who will listen to take care of their teeth! Until you don't have them you have no idea. I can not go out to eat unless your talking soup. It is a pain in the ass!

 

[Barb1]

It's SUCH a bitch to be on the SS scale :-(. People who have not been there (or loved people who are there) have a tough time getting it. I'm very glad to be connected to the organization for which I'm doing development/fundraising precisely BECAUSE of this type of education I'm getting. It's fucking insane.

If you are able, a Costco membership could pay for itself quickly. Since you're out in "Middle America," I suspect that the grocery access alone would be a HUGE difference, plus the gas if you have a gas station there. You might check on the savings for pharmacy, as well.

I will tell anybody who will listen that they need to consider the cost of the upkeep after the DS. I knew what vitamins would cost but when you take in protein powders or any type of complications, labs, extra Dr. appointments it can overwhelm a person, but still so worth it in the end! I am so much better than I was last year. It has just been a slow process but I can eat and a year ago I couldn't! Oh and I wanted to tell you my GI doc is going to order my iron infusion in July.

 

[Barb1]

Barb - I know how expensive they are, but if there is ANY way you can get implant supported dentures, do it - before you lose so much bone in your jaws to make it difficult to impossible. My husband has them, and can eat normally again after 35 years of living on cheeseburgers and fries. His uppers are (semi)permanently affixed; the lowers are clipped to a bar. Most importantly, the uppers don't have a palatal plate - that used to gag him.

Most importantly, the uppers don't have a palatal plate - that used to gag him.

Oh how I would love that! The roof of my mouth is to flat so my dentures don't conform to stay in my mouth. I have to use adhesive and that plate also causes you to lose a lot of the taste of food.

 

[DianaCox]

You are fortunate to know enough about nutrition to manage, albeit with serious compromises. My husband basically could not eat anything harder than a cheeseburger for years, and would often choke on the lettuce - if nobody was around, he wouldn't even wear the uppers, because they were so uncomfortable (he was amazing at hiding it behind his mustache and his speech was perfectly clear). His diet sucked, and he was very self-conscious about it.

Even after he got the lowers fixed, and a better upper denture, the gagging from the palatal plate was too uncomfortable to wear it all the time. Because so many years passed between losing his teeth in his mid-20s and getting the implant-supported denture (the final installation was on his 60th birthday), it took well over 15 months to get the upper done - he ended up having 2 of the 6 implants that were needed fail, and then he had to get bone grafting and to wait for the grafts to take and then try again - the entire time the first grafts were taking, he couldn't wear the upper plate at all - so NO chewing. That was 6 months - and then when the two implants failed, and he had to have the bone graft surgery, I asked the prosthodontist if he could modify his old plate temporarily to screw it into the implants that did take - and it cost a pretty penny but at least while the grafts and then implants were healing, he had teeth "bolted" on (he had to be very careful to not chew hard, because they were not designed for that use). But at least because the denture was screwed into the implants, the prosthodontist was able to cut out the palatal plate!

He grudgingly admits it was eventually worth it, but for a long time he resented me for having pressured him to do it - he was miserable for a long time. And for the first six months after it was finished, he still didn't eat normally. He finally can eat steak now though, and corn on the cob, and nuts. It has made a huge difference in his quality of life.

 

[DianaCox]

Of course implant-supported dentures don't need a palatal plate at all - it is an overdenture screwed semi-permanently onto the implants (the screw heads are covered with dental filling material so you can't see the screws, and if the overdenture needs to be taken off, the prosthodontist just drills out out the filling "cap" and then takes out the screws). That is one of the best parts of the implant supported dentures - no palatal plate, so no gagging, plus they can't fall out and don't need adhesive at all.

And at one point, when he couldn't eat normally, so he ate a lot of slider foods (cheeseburgers, mashed potatoes, fries, full sugar sodas, he weighed almost 250 lbs. He's under 200 now - because he can eat more protein and vegetables and salads.

 

[huneypie]

This is not quite true. Collagen protein is LESS useful than, say, ribeye, or whey isolate, or egg white, but it's not UNavailable. If it's the only supplement you can gag down, it's better than nothing, and probably better than a plant source protein supplement (though I do not have data on hand with which to back up that claim).

I thought we couldn't count them for the same reason we don't count protein from pork rinds as neither are absorbed.

 

[Elizabeth N.]

I thought we couldn't count them for the same reason we don't count protein from pork rinds as neither are absorbed.

That's not accurate. It's a matter of quality of the protein source, not about absorption or lack thereof. Again, think "better than nothing" if you have NO other options. But keep looking for more options.

 

[DianaCox]

I thought we couldn't count them for the same reason we don't count protein from pork rinds as neither are absorbed.

That makes no sense, of course. OF COURSE the protein (i.e., the amino acids that make up the protein) is absorbed - it's just that it is incomplete protein, because it does not contain a balanced amount of amino acids to build all of the proteins we need.

If you go to the grocery store and buy a bunch of food totaling 2000 calories, including fixings for making dessert, but not including all of the ingredients for the main course, you have enough food, but not a balanced diet. You can't make all your proteins with a single source of protein that is incomplete, like collagen is - it will be like having a lot of flour but not enough meat to make a complete meal.

 

[huneypie]

I've done a few searches and it's confirming what I thought was the case:

"Hydrolysed collagen protein has a biological value of 0. That is to say when it is ingested by itself, the body uses virtually none of the protein; it passes straight through the body. So with certain supplements you are literally throwing your money straight down the toilet!"

http://www.ldnmuscle.com/the-problem-with-collagen/

That makes no sense, of course. OF COURSE the protein (i.e., the amino acids that make up the protein) is absorbed - it's just that it is incomplete protein, because it does not contain a balanced amount of amino acids to build all of the proteins we need.

If you go to the grocery store and buy a bunch of food totaling 2000 calories, including fixings for making dessert, but not including all of the ingredients for the main course, you have enough food, but not a balanced diet. You can't make all your proteins with a single source of protein that is incomplete, like collagen is - it will be like having a lot of flour but not enough meat to make a complete meal.

 

[DianaCox]

I've done a few searches and it's confirming what I thought was the case:

"Hydrolysed collagen protein has a biological value of 0. That is to say when it is ingested by itself, the body uses virtually none of the protein; it passes straight through the body. So with certain supplements you are literally throwing your money straight down the toilet!"

http://www.ldnmuscle.com/the-problem-with-collagen/

That ADVERTISING website is full of shit. Collagen is protein - it is merely INCOMPLETE protein. If you eat beans, you also get a different version of incomplete protein (which is why vegetarians eat rice and beans - they complement each other's incompleteness to yield a complete protein balance).