My Non Surgical Weight Loss before Surgery...

Spiky Bugger

Well-Known Member
Denis,

We realize that we are merely a bunch of strangers on the internet, but many of those posting have not only been down this road themselves, but they (we) have been reading--patient accounts, doctors' writings and research publications among other things--about bariatric surgery, most of us DAILY, for over a decade.

Tha fact that none of us has ever heard of this surgeon does not, by itself, mean that you are speeding down a one-way street in the wrong direction.

But it can mean--and has meant in the past with other pre-ops--that a surgeon who is neither experienced nor qualified to perform the ONE bariatric surgery that has provided the longest-lasting and most effective relief for SSMO patients is in the process of trying to convince you that HE knows, upon meeting you for the first time, that the surgery he WANTS to perform is best for you. (And it just so happens that the DS is the wrong surgery for ALL his patients...curious, that.)

Print out Diana's questions...take them with you...and add this one:

Do you have an online or in-person support group where I can meet some of your other DS patients and learn about their experiences post-op?

Sue
 

Denis Korb

Well-Known Member
Dr. Cox and Sue, I will certainly ask all of those questions when I meet him...so far I haven't met him, I have only met the PA at the weight loss clinic who works for Dr. Still who I also haven't met yet. My understanding is that I will meet the surgical team at my next "Surgical Class" which should be either sometime this month or early next month. I know that the Weight loss clinic has a Support group that meets, but due to my inability to utilize the one vehicle in my household I cannot attend that meeting. All of my Doctor Visits are arranged via ambulance transport and cleared via my Insurance as medically necessary. As part of my 2 required group sessions utilizing Obesity help website was acceptable to them, and I explained how I got invited to your forums and they were willing to accept Bariatric Facts as my second help group.

I specifically asked if he did the BPD/DS or the SADI, or the DS, I was told the BPD/DS, and the paperwork image I'm looking at clearly says the Biliary Pancreatic Diversion with Duodenal Switch and Sleeve Gastrectomy. The Image has the Sleeve with a 250cm Alimentary limb and a 100cm Common Limb.

On the OH forums it has Dr Petrick as doing the DS (shrug) so I wont know until I meet him which it truly is.
 
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chevtow

Well-Known Member
Denis my surgeon wasn't well known either, but had done a few people I talked to on OH. They liked him and I met him at one of their seminars. Afterwards he spent an hour talking with me about the surgery and quizzing me to see if I had done any homework on the DS, he didn't like giving it to just anyone. My wife and I both really liked him and felt comfortable so I went with him. Plus it was only a little over 2 hours away which was nice. So far everything is working as advertised :)
 

Munchkin

Full of Fairy Dust
BTW Denis, I have also been around the boards for about 15 years and I have never heard of your doc doing the DS. Maybe he does, and maybe he doesn't. If he doesn't, it's called 'Bait and Don't Switch'. The idea is to get me, the desperate fatty, into the office and then sell me on whatever procedure they do. And they will outright lie to convince you their procedure is better. Always follow the money. Just so you know, this does happen. A lot! Docs can say whatever they please on OH. Docs are greedy humans just like everyone else. Shop just like you were buying a car. Critical thinking rules! Surgeons are cutters and not worthy of worship.

Just so you can get an idea how this works, right now *I* believe there are no well known DS surgeons in Delaware. There may be a couple who do the DS once in a while but there isn't anyone doing the DS as a big part of their practice. Look at all the bariatric surgeons in Delaware on OH. See how many SAY they do the DS. Then see if you can find ANY patient who had the DS using this doc. Look for reviews of DS patients who used this doc. Can you find any? If you can't it's almost a safe bet it's a 'Bait and Don't Switch' deal.

Next look up all the DS patients living in Delaware and see who did their surgeries. I have never lived in or even close to Delaware but I know it's small and you may want to check other states close to Delaware too. I admit I can find it on a map but that's about it.

The Geek in you will make you do this.

And I'm not saying your doc doesn't do the DS. I'm just saying you need to do your due diligence and make sure you are OK with his experience level.
 

DianaCox

Bad Cop
You would be better off calling Petrick's office and asking for a contact with one of his post-op DSers than waiting for someone on OH to answer you. Because I doubt there will be an answer.
 

DianaCox

Bad Cop
@Munchkin : "Just so you can get an idea how this works, right now *I* believe there are no well known DS surgeons in Delaware." Delaware Water Gap is in PA.
 

Munchkin

Full of Fairy Dust
BTW some kind person also posted on the FB groups for you asking if anyone knew about or had the DS with your doc. Response...crickets.
 

Denis Korb

Well-Known Member
So I have been watching my weight on my at home scale with the partially liquid diet the doctors have me on. Keeping in mind that my at home scale said 550 pounds when I was 554 at the Doctors office, it also said 550 when I was at 566. so I figure that it was topping out at 550 for some reason. it has only been 5 days since my Doctor weigh in and my scale over the last 2-3 days is saying 538-540. My next weigh in is on the 18th 2 days from now so with luck I may be down another 12 pounds in roughly a week.
 

DianaCox

Bad Cop
Most of what you are losing is water - early weight loss is from loss of glycogen stored in your muscles and liver; every pound of glycogen requires 4 lbs of water to keep it in solution. Note that a pound of glycogen has only about 1550 calories, whereas a pound of fat has 3500 calories. When you lose those first 10 lbs (2 lbs glycogen plus 8 lbs of water), you have only lost about 3100 calories total (if you had lost 10 lbs of fat, it would be 35,000 calories).

As big as you are, you probably have 20 lbs of glycogen + water) stored. So your first 20 lbs of weight loss probably only amounts to a 6200 calorie deficit, rather than 75,000 calorie deficit.

The next 40 lbs is NOT going to happen nearly as easily, because your body will resist losing fat FAR more strenuously than losing glycogen, and will slow down your metabolism and increase the efficiency in response to the caloric deficit, further damaging your metabolism. And the minute you stop starvation dieting, you are going to put the weight back on.

I hope you won't be surprised or disappointed - it's the science of weight loss.
 

robs477

Now an Angel in heaven
I hope you won't be surprised or disappointed - it's the science of weight loss.
@DianaCox.....Hahahahahahahahah!!!! I finally get to "correct" you!!!! :D, its actually, the REAL science of weight loss, which VERY few in science and especially the medical community understand and NOT what is "commercially" purveyed, accepted or taught to the masses.
 

Denis Korb

Well-Known Member
Most of what you are losing is water - early weight loss is from loss of glycogen stored in your muscles and liver; every pound of glycogen requires 4 lbs of water to keep it in solution. Note that a pound of glycogen has only about 1550 calories, whereas a pound of fat has 3500 calories. When you lose those first 10 lbs (2 lbs glycogen plus 8 lbs of water), you have only lost about 3100 calories total (if you had lost 10 lbs of fat, it would be 35,000 calories).

As big as you are, you probably have 20 lbs of glycogen + water) stored. So your first 20 lbs of weight loss probably only amounts to a 6200 calorie deficit, rather than 75,000 calorie deficit.

The next 40 lbs is NOT going to happen nearly as easily, because your body will resist losing fat FAR more strenuously than losing glycogen, and will slow down your metabolism and increase the efficiency in response to the caloric deficit, further damaging your metabolism. And the minute you stop starvation dieting, you are going to put the weight back on.

I hope you won't be surprised or disappointed - it's the science of weight loss.
Doctor Cox,
I in no way am questioning your synopsis, however if I'm eating nearly 2300 calories a day...does this still apply to me? I ask this because you say a starvation diet...but I am not starving by any means? Keep in mind also that I'm drinking 64-100oz of water daily. The way I understood this weight loss is my body is in ketosis because of the lack of sugar intake which is forcing my body to eat its fat stores? Keeping in mind I have been doing this diet modified from my original diet for over a month now.
 
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DianaCox

Bad Cop
You are still at a caloric deficit over your basal metabolic rate for your mass. It is "starvation" compared to your metabolic "need" to maintain your current weight, and the metabolic drive triggered by weight loss to regain what you have lost, and some extra, to avoid the "danger" your dysfunctional metabolism perceives from your ketosis. Thus, you are indeed losing fat, after depleting your glycogen stores, but your body will fight you harder and harder the more weight you lose. Your basal metabolic rate will decrease in excess of the adjustment to your lower weight; your metabolism will become more efficient at processing what you DO eat.

You will lose weight - but not as fast as you expect. And the minute you add back anything extra, you will regain. Until you fix your metabolism surgically, the misery you are putting yourself through with this diet is for naught in the long run. And face it - you cannot live on what you are currently eating for the rest of your life - it is far too limited and long term compliance with a deprivation diet is essentially impossible.

http://blog.ted.com/why-your-brain-doesnt-want-you-to-lose-weight-sandra-aamodt-at-tedglobal-2013/
 
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