Fat Cell Debate?

[Larra]

@Munchkin the stuff I've read had nothing to do with bariatric surgery adaptation. It referred to the general population, that being that some people absorb varying amounts of calories/day via the colon (and not just water) depending on, perhaps, what populations of bacteria have colonized their colons, and that this could be a factor for obesity and difficulty with weight loss in some people. But it's certainly also possible that after a malabsorptive operation like the DS our small intestines may adapt by growing more, or larger, villi to increase absorption back towards "normal".

 

[Sheanie]

I guess what needs to be done is a very controlled, food in - poop out study. I'd volunteer, but I don't think they could afford my upkeep. I require copious amounts of yarn and fabric to keep me occupied, which is very expensive. Otherwise, I'm in.

 

[newanatomy]

So we all laughed when @Spiky Bugger posted the glitter capsules but transit time is one of the things I would like to study. And the difference in the caloric value of the poop between the 2 groups. Cutting down transit time is also the logic behind my yet to be tried SF gummy bear diet. We know the DS cuts down transit time. Does it surgically change us from superabsorbers to superpoopers?

I don't need a fancy glitter capsule, carrots will give me a timeline.

 

[southernlady]

I don't need a fancy glitter capsule, carrots will give me a timeline.

Corn does it for me.

 

[Sheanie]

Corn does it for me.

In our family, when we eat corn, we say "See you tomorrow". So our kids called corn on the cob "See you tomorrow".

 

[DianaCox]

Spinach is my marker - raw or cooked, it is identifiable on the way out.

The takeaway lesson is that there are MORE calories in food than are indicated, but the calories have been "adjusted" by the Powers That Be to account for what the average person absorbs, minus what is never absorbed. BUT THOSE NUMBERS DON'T TAKE INTO ACCOUNT WE SUPER-ABSORBERS who extract more of the available energy out of the food than the average person.

It's really very "simple" - we are not lying about how much we eat, the PTB lied about how many calories were available to be absorbed in the first place. It is possible to gain weight on "1000 calories/day" when you are actually absorbing as much as 1400 calories from what was FALSELY described as 1000 cal worth of food. Add to that a super slow metabolism, and giving off very little in the way of calories in poop or by exhaling, and you get fat from what will cause others to lose weight.

 

[robs477]

Spinach is my marker - raw or cooked, it is identifiable on the way out.

The takeaway lesson is that there are MORE calories in food than are indicated, but the calories have been "adjusted" by the Powers That Be to account for what the average person absorbs, minus what is never absorbed. BUT THOSE NUMBERS DON'T TAKE INTO ACCOUNT WE SUPER-ABSORBERS who extract more of the available energy out of the food than the average person.

It's really very "simple" - we are not lying about how much we eat, the PTB lied about how many calories were available to be absorbed in the first place. It is possible to gain weight on "1000 calories/day" when you are actually absorbing as much as 1400 calories from what was FALSELY described as 1000 cal worth of food. Add to that a super slow metabolism, and giving off very little in the way of calories in poop or by exhaling, and you get fat from what will cause others to loose weight.

YES!! Now that is a real simplified way that even I can understand of your previous post and pretty much sums it up! It’s also something I never really considered as a possibility, excellent!

 

[robs477]

So much great info in this thread! Just woke up half an hour ago, so haven't had my ADD meds yet and not quite ready to tackle the numbers. Nevertheless, it all makes a great deal of sense.

I do get a bit irritated when people quote the calories in vs calories out mantra to me as the solution to all my weight problems, because it is clearly a very simplistic explanation of the reality and just gives people an excuse to abuse people who are obese and to accuse them of bringing it on themselves. Real life examples of how inaccurate that mantra is abound, if people would just take the time to stop and think about it.

My (female) IT manager, many years ago, lived on a diet of chocolates and doughnuts, and never exercised, but had a tiny frame and weighed all of 48 kg (105 lbs). Another girl I was at boarding school with ate constantly (and always had 3 slices of bread in addition to a big dinner and dessert at night, which made quite an impression on me at 11, lol!), weighed 47 kg (103.6 lbs) at 16 (fully developed) on a medium-large frame. Her case was different, because she had suffered from anorexia and almost died. After that she was always hungry, but couldn't put on weight, so obviously something had changed in the way her body processed food.

And think about it, the “normal” thin people like her look at us and GD, they must really pack it in. If I stay this thin eating all this bad food, why can’t they (us) just “cut back”. ALL people are products of our learned experiences and that’s all they know, from their learned experiences. What makes it even worse for us is when they’re Doctors and even worse, skinny endos!

 

[robs477]

Here's a very simple factor that most people don't know - we are taught that food is absorbed in the small intestine, and the colon (large intestine) only absorbs water. Turns out that some people continue to absorb nutrients, i.e. calories, in their colons, up to 500 additional calories/day. Maybe this is related to the type of bacteria populations different people have in their colons.
Those extra calories that we are so good at absorbing add up in a big hurry, and of course we as individuals have not been studied for this, but I think it's one of those factors that make some of us superabsorbers.

Which has nothing to do with the original subject of where fat goes when you lose weight, but is just one more factor in what is really a very complicated subject.

@Larra, it has everything to do with the original subject and where fat goes etc, GREAT points, thxs, so much info here!!

 

[robs477]

@robs477

So we all laughed when @Spiky Bugger posted the glitter capsules but transit time is one of the things I would like to study.

Sorry, but we don’t need no stinking “Glitter Capsules” to let us know that our “Spiky” is full of……..wit!

 

[Razbry]

Boy this is interesting stuff. Researchers...pay attention!

 

[jim1969]

I would have never thought of any of this. It has been beaten into my head for so long that I eat more calories than I burn!

 

[DianaCox]

To follow up about the additional variable Larra mentioned (because I just ran across it in a different context): http://www.scientificamerican.com/a...teria-in-dangerous-ways/?WT.mc_id=SA_Facebook

Jeffrey Gordon, a physician and biologist at Washington University in St. Louis, has done research showing that this relation between bacteria and obesity is more than a coincidence. Gordon notes that more than 90 percent of the bacterial species in the gut come from just two subgroups—Bacteroidetes and Firmicutes. Gordon and his team found several years ago that genetically obese mice (the animals lacked the ability to make leptin, a hormone that limits appetite) had 50 percent fewer Bacteroidetes bacteria and 50 percent more Firmicutes bacteria than normal mice did. When they transferred a sample of the Firmicutes bacterial population from the obese mice into normal-weight ones, the normal mice became fatter. The reason for this response, Gordon says, was twofold: Firmicutes bacteria transplanted from the fat mice produced more of the enzymes that helped the animals extract more energy from their food, and the bacteria also manipulated the genes of the normal mice in ways that triggered the storage of fat rather than its breakdown for energy.​

 

[star0210]

So, in essence, we need to get rid of this firmicutes bacteria in our systems!
or a leptin supplement?

 

[DianaCox]

I dunno - perhaps a fecal transplant from a thin person?