Read and learn what happens when you don't comply with DS lifestyle requirements

Ok - new here. Scheduled for DS mid October. I have been hearing a lot of troubling things on vitamins. Like if they have "itols" at the end they cause diarreha and gas ...? I haven't been in yet for my pre surgery prep talk but I would like to be a little more educated so that I can ask questions there as well.

ADEK....those are the vitamins needed right? Do you take those all in one chewable? What brand do you use? Is there enough D in that multivite becasue everytime I go to the doctor now (yearly) I'm always low on D and he gives me a weekly 50,000 for 2 weeks is all....??

What calcium brand is best? Iron?

How much do you spend monthly on vitamins?

Do you have a sheet or something that tells the normal ranges that we should be in in each? (Doctor may have or give this to me but I haven't been back in for 2nd visit yet)

Thanks for any and all feedback....getting nervous\ excited \ scared to death :) Steph
One thing we have learned as a group is to let the talk about what vitamins we need and how to eat LONG term as a DS'er to go in one ear and OUT the other. MOST surgeons are excellent cutters but are LOUSY in the vitamin/long term eating advice. And the NUTS are not much better.

Chewable...nope. Just pills

ADEK...forget ANYTHING that is marketed to bariatric patients and do NOT use an ADEK multi.
1) They are expensive and worthless
2) A generic centrum EQUIVALENT multi works just fine. I use the Kirkland Daily Multi (found at Costco)
3) For me...and this is based on MY labs, I do not take ANY A, E or B's at all other than what is in my multi. But I have to take significant amounts of DRY D3 and K. IF I used an ADEK multi, I would be toxic on A & E LONG before getting enough D or K.
4) Calcium needs to be a calcium CITRATE, If it doesn't say citrate ON the front label, it's the wrong one.
5) Iron...a carbonyl iron and/or heme iron is best if you can tolerate oral iron. Not everyone can.
6) Cost per month varies on what YOU need based on yoru own labs. What I spend is not the same as what others need.

The prescription D you are being given by your doctor will be worthless once you have the DS. You will need DRY based A and D and E and K (NOT a combo)

And welcome.
 
Ok - new here. Scheduled for DS mid October. I have been hearing a lot of troubling things on vitamins. Like if they have "itols" at the end they cause diarreha and gas ...? I haven't been in yet for my pre surgery prep talk but I would like to be a little more educated so that I can ask questions there as well.

ADEK....those are the vitamins needed right? Do you take those all in one chewable? What brand do you use? Is there enough D in that multivite becasue everytime I go to the doctor now (yearly) I'm always low on D and he gives me a weekly 50,000 for 2 weeks is all....??

What calcium brand is best? Iron?

How much do you spend monthly on vitamins?

Do you have a sheet or something that tells the normal ranges that we should be in in each? (Doctor may have or give this to me but I haven't been back in for 2nd visit yet)

Thanks for any and all feedback....getting nervous\ excited \ scared to death :) Steph
It isn't VITAMINS with itols (sugar alcohols)...I don't think I've ever seen one of those. It's food and protein shakes and, any more, even things that have REAL sugars sometimes also have sugar alcohols. And they give LOTS of people, including non-WLS people, diarrhea and other GI problems.

http://www.ynhh.org/about-us/sugar_alcohol.aspx


Get a copy of your last labs tests and you will see the "normal" values listed, probably as "range."
 
Ok - new here. Scheduled for DS mid October. I have been hearing a lot of troubling things on vitamins. Like if they have "itols" at the end they cause diarreha and gas ...? I haven't been in yet for my pre surgery prep talk but I would like to be a little more educated so that I can ask questions there as well.

ADEK....those are the vitamins needed right? Do you take those all in one chewable? What brand do you use? Is there enough D in that multivite becasue everytime I go to the doctor now (yearly) I'm always low on D and he gives me a weekly 50,000 for 2 weeks is all....??

What calcium brand is best? Iron?

How much do you spend monthly on vitamins?

Do you have a sheet or something that tells the normal ranges that we should be in in each? (Doctor may have or give this to me but I haven't been back in for 2nd visit yet)

Thanks for any and all feedback....getting nervous\ excited \ scared to death :) Steph
You need to go read all the basic stuff on this forum. No, we do not take all-in-one ADEKs, because they don't have enough D or A for us. The prescription D is oil based, which is fine for normal people. But after DS, we malabsorb oils and fats, and that is oil-based, so it's not any good. We take the DRY forms of the fat soluble vitamins (A, D, E and K). We take differing amounts, based upon EACH of our lab results.
 
Can someone in lay terms explain to me the difference between RNY and DS......as far as malabsorption? I know that both have some of this......do the RNY's need to be on such a strict vitamin regimen? Would you guys mind sharing your particular daily vitamin regimen...morning, noon, night...what and how you take it. I know that everyone is different and I would need to rely on my own labs BUT I really want a better idea as to what I'm looking at (scheduled for Oct. 21st). I know ADEK and Calcium..............Dry versus oil based.....BUT it seems that there are varying degrees and opinion on all of this.....What brands do you use...how much a month do you spend etc etc...
 
Can someone in lay terms explain to me the difference between RNY and DS......as far as malabsorption? I know that both have some of this......do the RNY's need to be on such a strict vitamin regimen? Would you guys mind sharing your particular daily vitamin regimen...morning, noon, night...what and how you take it. I know that everyone is different and I would need to rely on my own labs BUT I really want a better idea as to what I'm looking at (scheduled for Oct. 21st). I know ADEK and Calcium..............Dry versus oil based.....BUT it seems that there are varying degrees and opinion on all of this.....What brands do you use...how much a month do you spend etc etc...
Here is a visual of the malabsorption of the RNY versus the DS in vitamins/minerals:
http://bariatricfacts.org/threads/vitamins-minerals.54/#post-21117

Yes, RNY's will forever malabsorb vitamins and minerals even tho they regain their ability to absorb CALORIES after 18 to 24 months.

Several of us have shared our vitamin regimen here: http://bariatricfacts.org/forums/vitamins-labs.16/ And under Vitalady Links is a link to documents she put together for all the surgeries, yes, they are dated 2010 but the levels and types have not changed. Prices ARE different.

ADEK, NO!!!!! A and D and E and K...yes. Each is a separate pill cause we each need varying amounts.

Easiest way is to start with the Vitalady list...while we encourage buying from her, many do not. One note...many of her Tender label is made BY BioTech for her. So the Bio Tech and the Tender D3 are the SAME thing...both made BY Bio Tech.

I use the Kirkland Daily Multi...it's the Daily multi SHE send out and once we got a Costco, we started getting it ourselves.

Keep reading. I know it's confusing but at some point a light bulb will go off!
 
Here is a visual of the malabsorption of the RNY versus the DS in vitamins/minerals:
http://bariatricfacts.org/threads/vitamins-minerals.54/#post-21117

Yes, RNY's will forever malabsorb vitamins and minerals even tho they regain their ability to absorb CALORIES after 18 to 24 months.

Several of us have shared our vitamin regimen here: http://bariatricfacts.org/forums/vitamins-labs.16/ And under Vitalady Links is a link to documents she put together for all the surgeries, yes, they are dated 2010 but the levels and types have not changed. Prices ARE different.

ADEK, NO!!!!! A and D and E and K...yes. Each is a separate pill cause we each need varying amounts.

Easiest way is to start with the Vitalady list...while we encourage buying from her, many do not. One note...many of her Tender label is made BY BioTech for her. So the Bio Tech and the Tender D3 are the SAME thing...both made BY Bio Tech.

I use the Kirkland Daily Multi...it's the Daily multi SHE send out and once we got a Costco, we started getting it ourselves.

Keep reading. I know it's confusing but at some point a light bulb will go off!

Thanks - It is coming slowly. But just when I get my head wrapped around what I'm about to do....I read something else and it scares me and makes me question my decision. Were you like that when deciding to have surgery? I don't know if it's something trying to tell me not to do it....but when I think that I get really down because I can't imgaine continuing on living (nonliving) life at this weight! UGH

I was just trying to read your labs....feeling very 'uneducated' there! HA .... If it's just a matter of taking vitamins 3 times a day - check my labs twice a year - GREAT....BUT if it's that I will struggle and fight to maintain levels to not loose my teeth and break bones easily...then it makes me worry!
 
Can someone in lay terms explain to me the difference between RNY and DS......as far as malabsorption? I know that both have some of this......do the RNY's need to be on such a strict vitamin regimen? Would you guys mind sharing your particular daily vitamin regimen...morning, noon, night...what and how you take it. I know that everyone is different and I would need to rely on my own labs BUT I really want a better idea as to what I'm looking at (scheduled for Oct. 21st). I know ADEK and Calcium..............Dry versus oil based.....BUT it seems that there are varying degrees and opinion on all of this.....What brands do you use...how much a month do you spend etc etc...
Yes, the RnYs need to be on a strict vitamin regime, but very few surgeons mention that. And, until recently, almost no PCPs understood that. That's why RnY people went through stuff like going completely insane:

http://www.unboundmedicine.com/medl...ting_as_acute_psychosis_after_gastric_bypass_

google "bariatric beriberi"

IMHO, RnY can be more dangerous because "everyone" thinks that the DS is dangerous and gives DS patients a full vitamin regime to follow and the best surgeons send their patients out with routine lab tests two to four times a year, for YEARS after the surgery. Meanwhile, the RnY surgeons cut and send them back to their PCPs who have no clue...and their teeth fall out and they get crazy.
 
Thanks - It is coming slowly. But just when I get my head wrapped around what I'm about to do....I read something else and it scares me and makes me question my decision. Were you like that when deciding to have surgery? I don't know if it's something trying to tell me not to do it....but when I think that I get really down because I can't imgaine continuing on living (nonliving) life at this weight! UGH

I was just trying to read your labs....feeling very 'uneducated' there! HA .... If it's just a matter of taking vitamins 3 times a day - check my labs twice a year - GREAT....BUT if it's that I will struggle and fight to maintain levels to not loose my teeth and break bones easily...then it makes me worry!
LOL...I'm STILL learning.

But if you had seen some of what I wrote before I had my DS while I was still in the very first months, you would not know it was me...I WAS CLUELESS. In fact, a very good friend had to take a figurative 2 X 4 to the side of my head. But it will happen...just KEEP reading and asking questions.

Heck, even *I* have trouble reading my labs. But that also comes with time and "listening" to what others say in posts. In that respect, google can be your friend.

Remember, this is for you.

I figured out LONG time ago that *I* had to know as much about my ailments/diseases/conditions as possible. I was the only expert *I* had. There is not a doctor out there who has as much a vested interest in just YOU as you do. And they have many patients with many different diseases, YOU HAVE JUST ONE PATIENT...YOU! So learn all you can about you, what you are dealing with and what you are planning to deal with. Be assertive and ask questions. Do not accept the "because I am the doctor" line...you know what they call the person who graduates at the bottom of his medical school class? Doctor!
 
OK, this may be a bit unusual for me, because I don't suffer fools gladly, but you need to remember that Walter's medical conditions are a bit more complex than usual - he also suffers from diabetes insipidus, which has nothing to do with type 2 diabetes, and requires that he is monitored closely by an endocrinologist who understands that condition in particular. Finding someone who takes his insurance willing to learn about the DS too is a challenge - but the DI not properly treated could kill him faster than the DS.

Nevertheless, having said that, Walter, I too am fed up with your manner of communication with others - as I have told you more than once in the past. Your refusal to review and correct your posts and thereby make it easier to read and understand them is beyond annoying - it exhibits a lack of consideration for your readers and people whom you are asking for help that is rude and insulting.

What the fuck is an "endcrist?" If you mean an endocrinologist, WRITE IT OUT! Your grammar and spelling are atrocious, and there are plenty of tools available to you to fix that - write your damned posts in a Word document, let the program check your grammar and spelling, and FUCKING READ WHAT YOU WROTE and fix the gibberish before you post it!

Your cheapness is well known among the DSers Walter - cheap to the point of stupidity. With your medical conditions, you should have had your DS as a self-pay years before you finally got it covered - who knows how much irreversible damage you did to your body before then? You have been told over and over and over again that you are doing things wrong with supplementation, and how to fix it - but you insist on waiting until you can convince a doctor to prescribe something WHICH CAN'T BE PRESCRIBED. This is ASININE!! Yes, you have now fixed at least the vitamin D - but sheesh, how much yelling at you did it take?? Look at how many people have felt the need to take the time to write posts in response to your dumbshit posts! You even got Larra annoyed enough to snark at you, and she NEVER gets annoyed (in public).

And finally Walter, it should be clear to you by now that you often don't seem to understand how to take care of yourself and your DS properly, yet I see you posting all over the place with "advice" to others. You seriously need to shut the fuck up - you almost NEVER give useful advice, and instead, give WRONG advice which makes the situation worse, because it confuses the situation. JUST STOP IT! Admit to yourself that you don't know enough to help, and resist the urge to give advice to others.

Based on your behavior over the years, you are like a doddering old uncle - you annoy us, you worry us, and while we care very much about you and your health, and admire (in some ways) your persistence, you piss us off when you continue to behave in the same way year after year, message board after message board. You need to start paying attention to what you are told here, try to actually LEARN something rather than asking questions and ignoring the answers, and you most DEFINITELY need to stop posting misinformation, because most of the time, you get it wrong.

I'm sorry if this seems harsh Walter - but you NEED our help, and we need you to be a responsible and considerate citizen on the message boards.
Diana...I think I love you. :)
 
I have not read all the posts, but I sure pray whoever has the DS takes their vits and does their labs religiously. I have known 3 people who have died for improper follow up. So sad as they left children and families.
 
A DSer on a FB group very kindly granted permission to post this VERY important cautionary tale about what can (probably WILL) happen to a noncompliant DSer. This is not the author's story, but that of a family member.
"(A family member) had this surgery about 16 years ago. he wasn't good about keeping up with information and never supplemented properly. His laundry list of health issues is so long, he's lucky to be alive.
He developed osteoporosis at about five years i...n, which was detected when he had a seizure and broke his back the first time. The osteoporosis in his spine is so bad now, that he's had several back surgeries and broken his spine multiple times. He now has a permanent pain pump implanted, and is stooped very badly and has to use a walker.
His endocrinologist said that my dad had the lowest levels of D he'd ever seen. They were almost negligible.
He's also dealt with leg weeping and sores due to low blood albumin (too little protein), and low blood salt, among other things. I'm sure he's deficient in just about everything. Honestly, he's very lucky to be alive at this point, and one bad fall could kill him.
He's better about supplementing calcium and vitamin D now, but that's about it. He still doesn't take care of himself well.
That's my cautionary tale to everyone. This surgery WILL ruin your life and possibly kill you if you do not take/eat what you are supposed to, no ifs, ands or buts."


Oh hey, that's me! Well, my dad. Jeez, I underestimated how long it had been when I wrote that. It was 1995, so it's 20 years now, not 16. I've started losing track of things like that lately, wtf mid-thirties, thanks. He's doing better since this was written, as people can see in my other post. Thanks for sharing his story! :D
 
A DSer on a FB group very kindly granted permission to post this VERY important cautionary tale about what can (probably WILL) happen to a noncompliant DSer. This is not the author's story, but that of a family member.
"(A family member) had this surgery about 16 years ago. he wasn't good about keeping up with information and never supplemented properly. His laundry list of health issues is so long, he's lucky to be alive.
He developed osteoporosis at about five years i...n, which was detected when he had a seizure and broke his back the first time. The osteoporosis in his spine is so bad now, that he's had several back surgeries and broken his spine multiple times. He now has a permanent pain pump implanted, and is stooped very badly and has to use a walker.
His endocrinologist said that my dad had the lowest levels of D he'd ever seen. They were almost negligible.
He's also dealt with leg weeping and sores due to low blood albumin (too little protein), and low blood salt, among other things. I'm sure he's deficient in just about everything. Honestly, he's very lucky to be alive at this point, and one bad fall could kill him.
He's better about supplementing calcium and vitamin D now, but that's about it. He still doesn't take care of himself well.
That's my cautionary tale to everyone. This surgery WILL ruin your life and possibly kill you if you do not take/eat what you are supposed to, no ifs, ands or buts."
 

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