Yet another vitamin interaction, E and K

KathrynK

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At a very upscale restaurant, all of the sudden, for no descernable reason my nose started to bleed, high up and it couldn’t be stopped until I packed the nostril with Kleenex and pressed hard against the side of my nose for several minutes in the bathroom. My fancy white napkin suffered the worst of it, because it was a substantial bleed. I have been bruising a lot recently, so I suspected something with vitamin K was involved. I’ve had more minor nose bleeds that I attributed to constant air conditioning during the summer.

My K levels have always been good, and I lowered the K1 dose when I started taking vitamin K2 (MK-4) in rather high doses recently for its potential effects on osteoporosis. But, there hasn’t been a change in my vitamin E dose for years, and again, it’s been in normal limits. So, now I read for the first time than Vitamin E competes with vitamin K for absorption. But it’s nit my E that is showing symptoms. http://69.164.208.4/files/Vitamin E and K interactions – a 50-year-old problem.pdf

I feel like I am robbing Peter to pay Paul with all of these interactions. It’s not just K1 but also K2, that interacts with E. After the nose bleeding and bruising, I upped my dose of vitamin K1, and continued high dose K2, but now I’m thinking of lowering my dose of vitamin E.

Has anyone been told of this interaction by your nutritionist? Did they offer any suggestion? Do you alternate E and K in your dosing regimen? I am not sure taking them at different times of day is enough, since they compete for the same metabolic pathway and I don’t think that’s over in a few hours. Since I am having symptoms of deficiency, do you think I should start the every other day regimen. Or every other week? Or up the K and reduce the E in half until the bruising is better?
 
I know I don't absorb Vitamin E...but (true confession time) ever since I stopped taking ADEKS...maybe a decade ago...I haven't taken E.

'Spoze I'm gonna die now?
 
What dosages of K1 and K2 are you taking?
Ray, these are the latest doses (all dry formulations)
K1 100mcg (and whatever is in my multivitamin)
K2 150 mcg
E 400 IU

Spiky, you are a rebel. I am beginning to think that whatever we call “normal” values of vitamin levels are arbitrary,and different for each person. (And, death is not usually the first sign of deficiency!)

Southern Lady, I don’t know my PT/PTT/INR lab values. When I was fat, I had a pulmonary embolism and a cerebral hemorrhage, both sides of the bleeding spectrum. But since surgery, this was the most dramatic bleeding event. I have had surgeries, physical and dental, without a bleeding issue, since DS. But, I have anemia, so this amount of bleeding is not good for that either.

I made an appointment with my internist, to look into all of this. He doesn’t follow vitamin dosing after DS, so I rely on the surgeons office (and this website) for that. He gave me a blank stare when I started talking about zinc, iron, and copper interactions, so I gave up trying to talk about it with him. But, he’s my PC and I need him to open the other doors of healthcare. Stay tuned.
 
Kathryn, if your PT/PTT/INR wasn't pulled, ask for it to be done. If in normal range, then don't get completely weirded out (just bothered about it).

BTW, I don't yet take vitamin E either. Haven't needed it...and maybe I am getting enough in my multi for ME.
 
The worst part about K is trying to get labs to process it correctly.

In all of this, how is your PT/PTT/INR lab values?

My doctors have all wanted to use PT/PTT/INR to decide if my K is out of range. Faster, cheaper, etc.

As I have mentioned, I was on the gurney, IVs in, getting prepped for a kidney stone procedure and I flunked the INR test. They unhooked me, sent me home and rescheduled the procedure. So, in hospital, the INR results are almost immediate.
 

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